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- The following is a transcript of conversation with writer-researcher
Ron Bach regarding hypotheses of Alan F. Alford, Zecharia Sitchin, and
Erich von Daniken. Mr. Bach's earlier articles are available by entering
'Ron Bach' in our site search engine.
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- JR = Jeff Rense RB = Ron Bach
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- JR: Hi Ron, it has been more than one year since we talked
about UFOs and comets/asteroids and the end of the world...
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- RB: Well, yes Jeff, true. Last we talked was what predicted...
hits in November or August? Anyway, a lot has happened since. Firstly,
as I noted in my previous articles at your site, neither the asteroids
arrived nor was Y2K a serious issue. But I was rather intrigued by Alford's
three-part article about ancient mystery schools, religion, God, heaven,
and underworld. So I wanted to put things in their right perspective.
So, here I am trying to be supportive as well as presenting a balanced
critique to your audience.
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- JR: Do you mean you disagree with Alford's hypothesis?
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- RB: Well, yes and no. I am in a rather difficult position
here as over these years I have become fond of Alan Alford, Erich von Daniken,
and Zecharia Sitchin's writings. In fact, I myself have spent three decades
researching ancient Sanskrit texts - what I fondly refer to as AST, and
have come to a conclusion that all of us - humanity - have off-planet
origins.
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- I would like to add that despite being critical of Richard
Hoagland in my first article at your site, I support Hoagland's premise,
amongst several other researchers, that we might have arrived here from
Mars.
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- JR: Interesting. Please elaborate.
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- RB: Sure. If you remember, Alford's first book "The
Gods of the New Millennium" was very supportive of both von Daniken
and Sitchin's hypothesis. I might add that Sitchin only claims to be a
reporter so I might be misusing the word hypothesis with his works, namely,
"The Earth Chronicles" amongst others. However, in "The
Phoenix Solution" and thereafter, Alford seems to have turned 180
degrees - by his own admission - of whatever he wrote or believed while
compiling "The Gods of the New Millennium".
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- I personally believe that Alford was right on track with
"The Gods of the New Millennium" but rather veered off course
with his later works. However, I reiterate that this is my personal belief
and I might be wrong, so please make your own decisions and judgments.
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- Now onto the Mars issue amongst other things, I am sure
that your audience hears a lot about Mars and evidently after the "Face
on Mars" issue, Mars is really getting hot. Ironically, ancient Sanskrit
texts also refer to Mars as a hot planet and even the Chinese (Cantonese)
call Mars "Fo Sing". Where "Fo" means fire and "Sing"
means star.
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- As you know Jeff, I have lived in India, Nepal, China,
and Hong Kong amongst several countries on all continents of our planet
and I am very fluent with all these languages as well as their ancient
literature. And my hobby or rather goal is similar to all researchers currently
engaged in exploring mythology - meaning to explore our true origins.
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- Almost all cultures - especially Far East, Central Asia,
as well as Middle East - that I have come across, strikingly bear the same
parallels and same mythology, to the extent that even their creation stories
as well as Gods are similar.
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- So when Alford says that the Gods were comets or what
have you, I would have to totally disagree. For example, in his three-part
article at your site, Alford allegorizes that:
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- "ONCE UPON A TIME, according to Sumerian lore, in
the days before mankind had been created, a rogue demon known as Zu had
stolen the so-called 'tablets of destiny' from the Earth, causing the crucial
'bond' between Heaven and Earth to be broken. As Zu flew off to his heavenly
'mountain', the gods on the Earth were plunged into darkness. Who would
stand up to Zu and recover the magical tablets? The challenge was accepted
by a god named Ningirsu, who soared up into the Sky and launched a fierce
attack upon Zu, using seven mighty whirlwinds and fourteen storm-floods.
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- Zu was defeated. He was cast down to the Earth in the
form of a 'Sling-Stone', and his heavenly 'mountain' was smashed into pieces,
causing a huge flood of ice and rock to fall upon the Earth below. In triumph,
Ningirsu returned to the Earth flying the 'Imdugud-bird' - the celestial
vehicle of his defeated enemy Zu.
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- Thus it was that the Sumerian king Gudea came to build
the Eninnu temple - commemorating not only the capture of the Imdugud-bird,
but also the act of creation by Ningirsu, which fecundated the Earth and
turned it into a lush garden of paradise."
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- I could cite you the Vedic references and specifically
Markandya Purana - where Purana means genealogy and Markandya was a sage,
which describes the exact same story. Only the name Zu is changed to Shumbh
and Nishumbh in Sanskrit - notice the similarity to the pronunciation Zu
in Sanskrit? And instead of Ningirsu it was Navdurga - where in Sanskrit
Nav means nine and Durga means the Goddess mother. In fact if instead of
reading the entire Markandya Purana in Sanskrit, if you only read the Chandi
Paath - a religious text even read today in sub-continent India, you could
basically get the same story in details that Alford is talking about. Although
I doubt there is any English translation of that story and I will be happy
to translate that mythological story in English on my upcoming web site
if your audience so desires.
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- JR: You bring up the term God and these so-called beings,
namely Zu and Ningirsu. Alford seems to suggest that God is a celestial
or heavenly body that descended upon Earth. How do you see God and are
you religious, if I may ask?
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- RB: Good question Jeff. First let me tell you that I
am not religious in a conventional way. However, I am adamant that von
Daniken and Sitchin are much closer to the truth about "Gods"
being flesh and blood beings. However, I am puzzled that all of them, Alford,
von Daniken, and Sitchin, ignore the Vedic literature and mythology. Sitchin
has given some insights on Vedic cultures but in my opinion that is barely
a preview. Vedic literature refers to what some believe are the oldest
texts - for example Rg Veda - that we as humans possess. Vedic literature
is written in Sanskrit and currently Sanskrit is written in Devanagri script
whereas in the past Sanskrit was written in several rather outdated scripts
one of which being the Brahmi script. I must add that Sanskrit is thought
of predating the Sumerian clay tablets.
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- If you were to explore and exploit - and I consciously
use the term exploit - Vedic literature scientifically, then you will realize
that we humans were not as primitive as portrayed and Sumeria or Sumer
certainly was not the first civilization as accredited by major universities
around the world. In fact, "Sumeru Parvat" or rather Mount Sumeru
in English is constantly mentioned in Vedas alongside the Saraswati River.
And it is this mountain - as in mountains mentioned in ancient religious
texts - that was part of the "Gods" abode, another mountain being
"Kailas Parvat" or Mount Kailas in English.
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- The very fact that both Sumeru and Kailas mountains are
extensively mentioned in Vedic texts indicate that the Vedic cultures were
not descendants of Sumerian cultures but rather coexisted simultaneously.
This, due to the proven fact that Saraswati River dried up around 2000
BCE
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- For example, let me highlight a place called Lothal that
existed in what now is Gujarat State of India. All the Gujaratis are believed
to be descendents of Lothal. However, Lothal was a port that traded in
those days with what we refer to as Sumer or Mesopotamia and people from
Lothal migrated to all places including Middle East and what is now known
as Sri Lanka. Even the pottery, the inscriptions, the insignia, etc. found
in Sumer bear a striking resemblance to what was discovered in the Harappa
and Mohen Jo Daro civilizations. Apart from Lothal, another place of significance
not faraway is Dwarka or rather Bet Dwarka which is now under sea and Dwarka
the new Dwarka city is an exact replica of Bet Dwarka. And I must add that
the now dried up Saraswati river used to flow in branches through all the
above places and reached as far as Middle East via Rajasthan and Gulf of
Cambay - both in Gujarat State of India.
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- These places bear great significance in our origins including
that of Caucasians as you will see later in my book - The Star Federations
- which will not be published anytime soon.
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- I am rather disappointed by the fact that Sitchin gives
so little consideration to Vedic India or Indian sub-continent of that
time and in doing so has accidentally ignored the most important clue to
our origins. While Sitchin talks about Sumerians, Akkadians, etc., he is
either unaware or forgot to mention that Akkadians were a wandering tribe
that traveled between Vedic India and Sumer of those days. Perhaps Dr.
David Frawley can throw more light on this subject, as he is one man who
has certainly done his Vedic homework.
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- But to summarize this question, I will say that we all
humanity are descendants or rather refugees from planet Mars and Alford
has inadvertently supported my hypothesis in his three part article at
your site as well as his book "When The Gods Came Down".
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- JR: You are opening Pandora's box here.
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- RB: Yes Jeff, I know what you mean. But let me start
by saying that the search for Atlantis will be fruitless. That Mars is
Atlantis. That the deluge story that Sitchin has detailed and so have other
religious texts like Sumerians, Bible, Vedas, etc., are actually speaking
about the exodus from Mars to Earth and not on Earth itself. That what
Sitchin refers to as "splashed down on earth" and what Alford
refers to as "the Gods who came down to Earth did so amidst fiery
rocks and floodwaters" is nothing else but an emergency evacuation
from Mars to Earth.
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- So now going back to whether I am criticizing Alford
or supporting von Daniken and Sitchin, it is clearly evident that all of
them are just looking at parts of what the real truth might be. I must
admit that I too am a part of this and I am just the glue sticking these
people together.
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- JR: Ron, in this field we want proof and evidence. Most
readers will want hard evidence and might treat your hypothesis or story
as hearsay. What proof or evidence do you offer and how or why should we
believe what you say?
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- RB: Yes Jeff, your concern is very valid and I too am
skeptical, as many of my readers already know. But let me ask you a counter
question and then explain my premise. The question being, I have just lived
on this planet for approximately 4 decades something and so has everyone
else - at the most 8 or 9 decades - and these are events that occurred
thousands if not millions of years ago. How can anyone have any factual
evidence or proof? It isn't like going to a bank vault - even in Switzerland
- and getting out tablets, although that is exactly what Sitchin has done
by accessing materials from Museums and what have you. On the same count,
everything I have mentioned above is openly available in public domain
and if I might add in religious texts of several civilizations. Whether
one takes it as mythology or as the basis of my premise is ones own choice.
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- Therefore, I will have to say that once again, Alford
has half-truth and even that is worth reading and researching, as I have
known Alford to be one thorough personality. Perhaps being a chartered
accountant is what brings in the thoroughness and rigidity alongside discipline.
But then even von Daniken and Sitchin are equally sincere and zealous in
their goal or mission. I believe that such people are naturally born and
no amount of training can ever gear anyone in these fields.
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- Further to the other part of your question about why
people should believe in what I say, just think about this - How come we
have so many varieties of life forms and species on this planet and are
we to believe that apart from what we find on planet Earth, the rest of
the Universe is barren? Moreover, as I have mentioned earlier, I have indisputable
proof that we are from Mars, but I hope that you will accept that I am
entitled to preserve those evidences and facts until the publication of
my upcoming book -- The Star Federations.
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- JR: Fair enough and finally do you think NASA or others
- let us say certain groups or individuals - are privy to what you say?
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- RB: Jeff, I do not subscribe to conspiracies and immaterial
of all the hoopla about secret groups or agencies or what have you on the
internet, all I have to say is that those in command and power are probably
doing the best for our interests - humanity's interests - and further to
that I have no comments. Even I myself was born on 19.5 Northern Hemisphere,
and I am not associated with any secret societies so, go figure. In other
words, we can get to be as paranoid as we want to be.
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- JR: Thanks Ron, it was nice talking to you. How can our
audience get back to you if they have questions?
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- RB: You are most welcome Jeff. Yours is truly an inestimable
show and site. From my past experiences, I rather not give out my new email
address, as I am afraid I will be overwhelmed. But you do have my private
email and if Alford, von Daniken, or Sitchin have any questions or comments
you can forward them my address. And I do promise to come up with either
an article or yet another interview where I will give out my new web site
and email address as and when appropriate.
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- I would further say Jeff, that you are the lead personality
in this field. Keep up that show as it is and we are all looking forward
to it. Keep up the great work and I always listen to your show on the Internet
and so does a great part of Asia Pacific from what I know. May the force
be with you and give my best to all your loved ones ever. Bye now.
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- JR: Bye Ron.
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