- "I am not the conscience of my compatriots":
Nobel prize-winning author Gunter Grass on his critique of the US superpower
and the connection between literature and politics.
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- This is an interview with Gunter Grass, published in
the 12/29/02 edition of the German paper, Welt-am-Sonntag (World on Sunday).
The interviewer is Subhoranjan Dasgupta, who conducted it for the Indian
weekly, Outlook. Outlook does have a presence on the internet but
it has not been posted there. So until now the full interview has been
available only in German, at http://www.welt-am-sonntag.de/data/2002/12/29/28511.html
- WamS: Mr Grass, what is your impression of George W Bush?
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- Grass: I regard this man as dangerous, a threat to world
peace. He reminds me of one of those figures in Shakespeare's historical
dramas, whose only ambition is to come before his father--the old, dying
king--to step up and say, "Look, I finished your project!" He
is determined to bring the Gulf War to a higher level of completion by
instigating a second one, Bush jr is guided by private, familial motives:
he is driven by what he inherited by his father. Also Bush's economic interests
play a role. The family is deeply involved in the business of oil. Above
all, what's behind the push for a war with Iraq are political and economic
interests.
-
- The third reason, of course, is the status of the USA
as the only all-powerful superpower in the world. The US administration
wants to control and direct the rest of the world but knows too little
about the world outside its borders. It knows almost nothing. The dangerous
combination of familial, economic and political interests along with such
ignorance leads a politician to become a real danger.
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- WamS: Does this obvious alliance of economic and political
interests mean that there is a connection between neoliberalism and terrorism,
which are now fighting each other?
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- Grass: Certainly. Immediately after the terrible attack
of September 11, I pointed out that the reason for this attack lies
in the anger and hate of the socalled third world toward the abundance
of the first world. So long as we do not root out the causes of this righteous
anger, the terror will continue. In the 1970's Willy Brandt directed our
attention to the terrible inequality which plagues the world, this deep
gap between the rich and the poor. He predicted that if we did not succeed
in establishing a new, more just social world order, violent outbursts
will occur. This is what we're seeing now, in the form of terrorism. Of
course, there are other reasons--cultural, regional, and historical--but
the main cause, the shocking inequality, should not be underestimated.
- I dream of a world order in which the developed and underdeveloped
countries sit at the same table, and that in this world the raw materials,
technology and capital are divided in the fairest way possible. So long
as this dream remains just a dream, there cannot be world peace.
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- WamS: Who is responsible for this situation?
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- Grass: The North and the West. In our world of overflowing
abundance, we have failed because we have protected our own interests at
the expense of others. This egocentric stance, this business of enriching
ourselves, is a natural result of neoliberal theory and practice, which
leads us to refuse to look beyond the edge of our own plate. It follows
that if Bush repeats his Afghan experiment in another part of the world,
he would thereby promote a new wave of terrorism.
-
- WamS: It seems to brand the current nature of capitalism
as the chief evil-doer.
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- Grass: Of course. After the collapse of socialism, capitalism
remained without a rival. This unusual situation unleashed its greedy and--above
all--its suicidal power. The belief is now that everything--and everyone--is
fair game. On the stock exchange what happens next is nothing more or less
than the destruction of Capital--and with it the destruction of industry,
jobs, and human resources. If a firm announces a lay-off of 200 workers,
their stock price climbs. That is insanity! The present form of market-blind
Capitalism has brought forth its own enemy, its own Frankenstein monster.
This system could collapse any day.
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- WamS: Nonetheless there doesn't seem to be an alternative.
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- Grass: We have none at the present time, nor do we know
whether we will have one in the near future. In this condition, where we
have a big, depressing vacuum, it's possible that a new form of fascism
may arise, a fascism whose face we cannot yet imagine. But we do detect
some signs of it fairly well.
- I don't believe in an unbounded Utopia, radiating out
hope in all directions. So I won't postulate a utopia as an antithesis.
I can only say that we must repeatedly oppose the way things are organized
today. The stone of Sisyphus must again and again be rolled back up the
hill.
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- WamS: Is Grass the author inseparable from Grass the
artist or is the artist autonomous and independent?
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- Grass: My creativity is characterized by a constant and
interactive relationship between the word and the line. The first example
of this collaboration is--naturally--my poetry. Believe me, the source
of many of my poems are designs and sketches. I have often translated the
first lyrical beginnings into designs, which then later gradually took
the form of words. Lyrics and design mutually encouraged and enriched each
other and they are located side-by-side in my poem volumes. The opposite
also has happened: I begin with words, then the words transform into designs.
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- WamS: In your world, then, words and pictures are not
to be separated.
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- Grass: This connectedness can be recognized also in my
prose, as much in novels like The Rat or A Wide Field as in biographical
works such as Show your Tongue and My Century. When I write,
the manuscript is not reserved just for words. I break through the flow
of the text with designs, sketches, figures. In my novels I actually visualize
the whole constellation of events and characters with these pictures. In
time the designs and pictures separate from the sides which are filled
with words. After laborious interventions they transform into independent
lithographs, water colors, designs and in some cases even sculptures. Thus
the relationship between the artist and the author functions on two levels,
in the first phase on the level of interaction and mutual enrichment and
then on the level of artistic autonomy.
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- WamS: Many people in Germany--and in Europe--regard you
as the conscience of post-war Germany, especially after the death of Heinrich
B°ll.
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- Grass: No, it would be completely wrong to view
me that way. Like B°ll I have always rejected the concept of being
the personified conscience of my compatriots. Tell me, whose weight of
conscience am I supposed to be carrying around, which consciences could
I try to relieve or purify? As a conscious citizen of my country and as
an author I am intimately connected to my society, to both its progressive
aspects and its backsliding. Based on my experiences and political
principles I support certain processes and rise in protest against others.
If there is a great political debate, I take a position. This engagement,
or if you prefer, this activism, is something I have always practised.
And I intend to stick with that in the future. In this respect I do not
promote or support the selfcenteredness of those authors who consciously
distance themselves from their social environment. But it doesn't mean
that I embody the conscience of anybody. I reject any role that puts
me as a representative of a group of people.
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- Translator - Anu de Monterice<mailto:coachanu@earthlink.net>
- coachanu@earthlink.net
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